Getting drivers to pay their share

It's always easier to make someone pay for using something than pay someone for not using something. There are quite a few different ways of implementing road pricing, and it doesn't have to be ridiculously expensive everywhere to make a difference. The cost per kilometre should vary around the GTA, and continue all the way out to Newmarket or even Barrie. If people could see what it costs to have a long car commute, many would rethink it.

There are so many ways that cyclists pay for unrestrained car use.

While congestion taxes are a great idea and I support them, I think that Toronto home-owners who can prove they have become car-free, whether by choice or by ciucumstance, should receive proerty tax breaks. Why shgould cyclists pay for the same for constant road maintenance when we don't cause any of the damage to the roads?

It is also unfair to downtown residents where the largest share of commited cyclists live to be subjected to the damage, destruction, hazard and pollution delivered by out-of-town commuters from Etobicoke, Scarborough and North York as well as 905 counties when we do not go to their neighbourhoods and cause similar conditions. Downtown residents should have the right to restrict traffic flow in their neighbourhoods and charge 'admission' for irresponsible car use. We should make driving prohibitive, not more convenient.

Perhaps to illustrate the point, we should all go dump toxic chemicals on the lawns and front decks of homes in Mississauga, Brampton, Richmond Hill, Aurora, Pickering and Ajax, among others. After all, that is only a little taste of the dangers they mindlessly subject us to.

The sad fact is, that downtown Toronto has very little housing in comparison to outlaying areas. Many more people commute here than live here, and choosing to live downtown is "choosing to live downtown".

I live in Whitby, and commute downtown by GO train. If I worked further north I'd drive because the infrastructure just does not exist to make it convenient. Two days, every other week, I cycle to work (96km round trip), so I'm not a car snob that cares not for cyclists on our roads.

I support the idea of pay-per-use tolls for cars and trucks entering the core, but the idea that out of town commuters are somehow "disrespecting" the neighbourhoods of those who live downtown is ridiculous. Downtown is what it is, busy, crowded, noisy, smelly sometimes..... These are the things that make it downtown, and that's not likely to change much for quite some time. Downtown is a place of business, if you choose to live here because it's exciting or convenient or whatever, remember that it's your choice to live here.

You don't buy a house on a golf course and then complain about the odd golfball that lands in your back yard do you?

I'm always a bit suspect to the notion that people should get their "fair share" of services for the taxes they pay. Taxes aren't service fees -- they are a way of spreading the overall costs widely enough that we can afford to take care of "the commons" -- the stuff that supports a civil society.

It goes back to the unfortunate notion that we are somehow consumers to government rather that citizens. The whole point of taxes is that some of us will pay for things we don't get and others will get more than they pay.

The notion that you should get equal services to what you pay in taxes is the same arguement, ironically, drivers make when they do an accounting of gas taxes vs. road budgets.

I think the real arguement for supporting cycling goes something like this:

• The GTA can no longer build more road capacity. It's too expensive, gets used up too quickly and we're having a difficult enough time maintaining existing infrastructure.
• We continue to have shared issues around congestion and pollution that will only get worse if nothing is done.
• Cycling can be part of the solution. Every trip made by bike is arguably one not made by car. This benefits EVERYONE. As a cyclist, I take up less space on the road, which benefits the drivers I share the road with (whether or not they realize it). And, obviously, that's a trip that doesn't contribute to pollution/climate change.
• Even if you never, ever will take a trip by bicycle, it is benefitial to you if other people do. It means less cars on the road (congestion) and cleaner air (health) -- benefits to all.
• It's also a lot cheaper to build cycling infrastructure than, say, greatly expand public transit. So, again, even if you never cycle, convincing others to do so is still in your best interest.

Given this, there is a payoff for everyone to encourage those who are willing to take more trips by bicycle. Encouragement comes from infrastructure, from education and from smart planning (like encouraging multimodal trips).

That's why we should have more support. Not because we as cyclists are somehow morally superior (I can assure you I'm not!). Not because we have some kind of inherent right (to what? Move from place to place on two wheels? To wear overly tight clothing?) But because cycling has a role to play in solving the pending transportation challenges we face.

Road tolls aren't a big enough net to scoop the cost of driving, they'd only be used on major highways.

The carbon tax shift should be encouraged.
We need a larger federal gas tax, big enough to make people rethink their habits is the easiest and most effective means to changing attitudes. Put massive taxes on every new car, soak them through licenses and registrations, these are why Denmark is further ahead - not because they're somehow better people.

Municipally we need to increase parking fees on streets and in lots, I can park a car for less than $10 each month in front of my house!
No more parking pads on front lawns, dig up existing ones. They're ugly, plus rainwater should seep through the ground, not be collected in drains.

Nail them wherever we can - right across the country.

The motoring lifestyle is subsidized from the general kitty, what to do about it? I support tolls as well, though as part of a greater tax reform.

We need to go further: a tax structure that characterizes road space and motorway infrastructure for what it is: a commodity, albeit a publicly owned and administered one.

Like any other commodity in a free market economy, the more you avail yourself of it, the more you pay; and, as per the dynamics of supply and demand, the price is reflected in the relationship. Downtown congestion surcharges, parking fees and road tolls all comprise this strategy.

No more free rides then. No more financial and environmental disconnects between cause and effect, action and consequence. A direct line connecting a decision and lifestyle to its costs and benefits is imperative in establishing rational behavioral and development patterns. Only then can beneficial systems like railways and healthy communities like walkable cities flourish.

I tend to agree with the sentiment that the cost needs to be picked up at the gas tax level, a method that hits the consumer of the fuel most directly. It also allows people to make choices about the size of their contribution toward road maintenance. For example, when I drive my RX-8 to work once a week, I would make a bigger contribution toward road upkeep than someone who drive his Prius, but it is my choice to make. What I don't agree with is the need of the feds to impose this tax. We've seen how bad they have been about helping out Ontario these days while the high dollar destroys manufacturing - do ou really think that anything they collected would flow back to the GTA? The tax needs to be a civic tax, then the money stays where it is collected.

If it's a civic gas tax, it will be worthwhile for every single GTA driver to head to Guelph or Lindsay or wherever to fill up outside the area.
Or head to the US, where none of us benefit.
Perhaps that's why a tax at the source needs to be done, as long as it makes driving prohibitive.

A lot of people won't think that far ahead and will need to tank up locally just to make the drive - besides for a large number of people, the money you save in taxes would be completely consumed by the gas consumed in making the round trip. Also, I suspect that most cities would probably find it hard to pass up the chance to make additional revenue. Toronto might choose to slap a 10cent tax on gas (just to throw out a number) and Lindsay might choose 5 cents to thumb their nose at TO - but I bet they would still do it.

The problem with different municipal gas tax rates is that there will always be two (or a lot more!) gas stations facing each other directly across the municipal border. One will have to charge the higher rate and will scream about it. Municipal politicians listen to screaming business owners.

Boosting the provincial gas tax is the way to go.

Sounds like the 416 suburban-hating-everyone-should-live-stacked-in-highrises lets bash 905 area mentality to me.

The suburbs arent going anywhere soon. some people, especially those with families, like to live in houses, yes, with decks and lawns, and space. And regarding the coments that implies 905 takes and doesnt give anything back - well, I'm pretty sure we here in pickering and ajax dont consume all the power being generated by the nuclear station - I see power lines from it heading west, maybe to power all those condo elevators. - not that I have a problem with that.

Last thing I want, as someone who is both a motorist and a cyclist, is yet more taxes. I'm already close to selling everything, and leaving this place because of being financially raped by the govt, and getting little in return. (My daughter is on a 1 year waiting list - apparantly that's "health care", Sure makes me feel good about handing over the health care tax) Now you want more taxes ? you want me give more money to those idiot theiving career politicians that cant even find a hole in the ground to put the garbage and so truck it to Michigan instead ?; Please.

Rant over.

I ride my bike to GO, commute by train to downtown. I like working there, no way I'd live there.
This site seems to be more for political activists than for cyclists. think I'll move along.