Ontario Place new path now open - and unsafe
I was trying to figure out whether to put this in advocacy, or commuting, or what, but this makes me so mad it had to be "general." It's pretty clear that Ontario Place always hated the bike traffic they had. Now people are going to die.
On July 31, the inaugural day of the new path, I, an experienced commuter with some 5000 km of pedaling per year, came that close to being roadkill. I was heading west, and crossing intersection #2 of 3. My "bicycle signal" was green. I was trying to deal with one car who was coming out of Ontario Place trying to turn right on red and not looking in my direction (why would they?). That one finally noticed me and stopped, and as I carefully proceeded across the intersection, someone darted in from the right (turning left off Lakeshore in a big hurry, engine roaring in the attempt to seize the very small left turn opportunity) and narrowly missed me. I had looked back there, but before having to stare down the right-turner, and I was gobsmacked that the left turner didn't wait, but that's what happened).
OK, everyone knows bike commuters are nuisance and expendable. But can you possibly imagine the weekends when families with kids are trying to get everyone across safely, trying to deal with tourists screaming through there from every direction? It just sucks so bad!
Yes, as soon as one of us is injured or killed, we will be punished and will get our own signal that we will have to wait a million years for at each of the 3 ridiculous intersections.
The old route was fenced off yesterday, but I plan to find a way to use it.
The old old (pre diversion behind the west gate ) route was not bad. Sometimes you had to stop at the big 4-way south of Strachan (good visibility, and traffic was slow, at least), sometimes there was confusion and chaos around the two gates (now the middle and west intersections), but rarely did it feel completely out of control like it does now. Now they've created a new problem that's just like the Boulevard Club driveway, only worse. These intersections have more traffic, and are a lot more likely to be tourists or occasional users who won't think to consider path users. It's going to be carnage!
When the plans for this were released I raised exactly those points. Crossing busy driveways adjacent to busy thoroughfares is dangerous business. That those concerns were so easily dismissed by Toronto Transportation and other bicycling advocates surprised me.
I swear Ontario Place staff drive at bicyclists. Security have tried to run me off the road there, staff routinely blow their stop sign. Ignorance? It strikes me as remarkably hostile for simply that.
I am reading this from Japan, on vacation from Toronto. My wife's family lives in a suburb of Tokyo, with too many cars and not enough bike infrastructure... but I'd cycle here any day! There are people of all ages on bikes on all the roads, even in an outer suburb, and the drivers give them full courtesy. Like Denmark, the people have a lifestyle that makes them thinner too (compared to N. Europeans and NE Asians in Toronto).
I used to care, but I can't give Toronto that much mental space anymore. I have to live there for work, but Toronto blows.
You know, I was going to make the same point on a forum at some point as I saw this thing going on.
I commute from Etobicoke along that path to downtown about 2-3 times a week and quickly came to the conclusion that the intersection would certainly be dangerous and probably an inconvenience.
And like you said, just the same situation as at the Boulevard Club. People rushing off lake shore across a bike path.
I liked the old system better.
I agree with your article regarding how unsafe those intersections are on the new path. Not to mention how narrow they close the opening. Too many other bicyclists think they can go through at 2 abreast. What is it with these guys thinking they can go down a path 2 abreast and ignore other people ? Too many bicyclists don't follow the rules and that gives the rest of us a bad reputation.
So my point is; It's not just bad car drivers, but bad bike riders to.
Now lets get these bad intersections changed. We has bicycle enthusiasts have to start voting strategically !!
I see the addition of bike lane signal lights as a step backwards, especially when they weren't required before. Might as well use the road. It's going to be crazy on summer weekends.
Another unnecessary hazard is the addition of the barriers on each side of the roadway- very difficult to see in the dark. Reminds me of the so called "improvements" they made to the path years ago by turning it to cross the parking lot entrances at a right angle- so now as well as navigating a way between the posts and watching for cars you have to negotiate the curve.
And while I'm venting, how about the detour around the airshow? Grrrr!
Great idea with the snow removal last winter. Too bad about the (lack of) drainage and subsequent ice, but it was a tough winter. A good first attempt.
I like the idea of signal lights here, we can't avoid crossing traffic so this makes it safer. I think it's good that we intersect at right angles, it makes it easier for drivers to see us.
I'm glad they straightened out the bike path to keep us away from tourists strolling along the water's edge as well.
At most intersections, the majority of traffic are the same people over and over again. When a change is made, those people quickly adapt to the new environment.
The biggest problem with Ontario Place is that it is a tourist destination. This means that different people will constantly be arriving (usually by car), and may never get the chance to learn how to cope with the new bike path crossings.
What are needed here are protected turn signals while the cyclists have a red, for all turning movements in or out. Not a continuous green which encourages the "darting" behaviour described above.
If we're already seeing close calls, it seems to me it is only a matter of time before a collision occurs, and all of the designers and planners (and so-called advocates) involved with this $10million project are culpable, that is negligent of their duty to protect.
Ontario Place wanted to build a new path to avoid interference issues ( and lawsuits ) with their customers and bikes. Collisions at intersections only take place if someone breaks a law and then it is not Ontario Places fault but the lawbreaker. I know it will still hurt somebody. The waters edge path is still planned but will take years and cost more. The path etc. they built cost about $1M. I don't like intersections and "P" gates either, but our paths must cross somewhere. I do like the new trees , grass and the easy to follow route. I rode it three times. The cars act like suburban cars do and are easy to spot when they make turns without looking. All of them stopped when I ( politely ) communicated with them just as I do and every intersection I cross. There will be more of these intersections built along the waterfront. If people find a workable, better design please bring them forward as these projects come up.
Clay
Clay,
I'm not saying that the trail should not cross the driveway(s). I heard from many of the people involved the difficulties in laying out where the path should go, and that its current alignments was the best compromise.
I'm saying that since it does cross the driveways, more concideration needs to be given to manage the crossings needed to happen than has happened to this point.
Allowing right turn on red is one problem, but even more severe is allowing left turns to enter these driveways whilst cyclists have a green. This is where conflict will most likely occur, and is what specifically needs more control. These entrances require protected (ie exclusive) left turn signals to enter, because drivers will not know to look (or perhaps cannot even see) cyclists approaching from behind. They'll be more concerned about avoiding the on-coming cars and trucks, and dart across thinking only of clearing the motor traffic before they collide with a cyclist.
Unless we're changing what a green light on a traffic signal means, and we just haven't told anyone yet...
As someone who has commuted many years on my bicycle AND as a member of the Blvd club please know that I ALWAYS STOP going IN and OUT of the club for EVERYONE on the path. I risk being rear ended by stopping on the lakeshore with other vehicles at 60 km per hour behind me. I slow down early and watch the path vigilantly. Most people DO stop and most users of the path are aware and cautious of their surroundings. As a cyclist you can wear your rights but still be hurt if you don't cycle defensively. Same for cars.
I don't think that broad strokes should be applied to everyone saying that no one stops.
I also agree that GOOD SIGNAGE helps a lot. Clearly the signage is not sufficient at Ontario Place. It's always been difficult to get around Ontario place and lots of cyclists never used the path that was provided. The route that had to be shared with pedestrians also had dangers to the pedestrians and cyclists.
In busy areas caution and care need to be exercised. That is common sense. I hope they continue to do all they can to keep the bike path (which is also used by roller bladers and pedestrians) safer for everyone to co-exist and keep it safe for all users. Drivers are going to need lots of warnings and reminders . I would hope that Ontario place would be happy to provide that information to the users of their lots.
While I know there was some effort to contact the former TCC for consulting by the Ontario Place officials, the progressives axed the committee into a 2/3 off pruning after a year's hiatus, and with no sub-committees. The volunteers weren't getting the bike lanes done fast enough though geez, I thought that was political decisions.
So in the relative absence of cycling inputs, it's not surprising that it doesn't work so well, as the planning and execution of things doesn't really make for safe cycling eg. Bloor eg. Wellesley.
More importantly though, through a post on bikingtoronto, I twigged to the issue of the private cars being a part of the problem, if not the totality (I don't bike down there myself too often so I don't like to really say what's up) but the overall planning and lack of planning for effective transit is the real issue.
This gets back to the Front St. Extension and the transit option that the progressives tout as the fix, the WWLRT.
Once upon a time there (c. 1993) there was a recognition of needing to bring transit to Ontario Place.
Not half a km away through a parking lot, but to the entrance area. But in our mixed-up and carrupt planning processes, we can't manage to now provide such an access, and must spend perhaps waste over a half-billion with the WWLRT that won't provide decent east-west quicker service to the Etobicoke area, and neglects Ontario Place.
Not that anyone's home, but yet again, our progressives are getting away with okaying inadequate things and wasting both opportunities and large amount$. If anyone is badly hurt, or worse, gets killed, please consider suing the City.
I think turn restrictions would help. I believe the traffic guys said it would only work if they got turning lanes. If only bike lanes got that kind of prioity. I have also been asking for traffic cops or crossiing guards to be there before and after events. They will be very important on the proposed Queens Quay MGT in front of the hotels, when the buses etc cross southside MGT. I am still waiting for a reasonable solution for the proposed Spadina cross over intersection. Here the proposed southside MGT will meet the existing curbside bikelanes. The eastbound lane will just go through but the west bound lane will have to cross over to the north side across the streetcar tracks. Thanks for all the interest. Be sure to E-mail " the powers that be " with your concerns and solutions
Clay
The design and implimentation of the new path, and the way they have completely blocked off the old path, leads me to assume that Ontario Place does not want one riding a bike to Ontario Place. I guess Ontario Place is more comfortable with a bike trail that by-passes Ontario Place than allows Ontario Place to be a destination for cyclists.
I rode through these crossings.
1) The "Bicycle Signals" are only accurate when they're red ("cyclists do not proceed"). When the bicycle signals are green (in theory, "cyclists proceed"), the crossings reduce to the same same layout as elsewhere would get a "Bicycles stop dismount and walk bike". The problem of turning cars encountering (to their surprise) bicycles is the same as at all the BSDaWB crossings, or even perhaps more so.
2) There appear to be attempts to separate cyclist and pedestrian paths right at the crossings. The markings are confusing, and there are more important things to be doing than watching the markings. Pedestrians and cyclists cross at random locations, randomized further by the quantum shutter effect of the p-gates.
3) I saw no warning signs for cars making turns from Lake Shore at these intersections to watch out for bicycles.
4) I would guess that the path will be sketchy to dangerous at night, as it's unlit and running parallel to Lake Shore Blvd. Headlights from eastbound cars shine right in the eyes of westbound cyclists. The trees in the berm will cast confusing shadows to boot. Good luck seeing anything, hope you don't hit a dark-clothed pedestrian!
Dan Egan still pines to slow down bicycles now that some of the bollards at the Boulevard Club have been removed:
http://www.thestar.com/gta/fixer/article/679229
But, there are still no signs warning turning motorists at the Boulevard to watch out for bicycles--as was promised by Councillor Perks (amongst others) years ago. I suspect the same fate for the Ontario Place crossings. As for the request to consider banning left turns in/out from the Boulevard Club, which could also work for at least some of the Ontario Place driveways, that appears to have sunk without a trace and I don't think the cycling committee is really following up on this.
The funny thing is that the much-less-used path beside Eglinton west from Scarlett includes signage warning turning motorists, and rather better layout and spacing at interesections. So this is something that the city has thought about and implemented.....just not where it's really needed!
I guess a brief deputation to the cycling committee would be in order.
What a total fucking jackass. I bet dimes to donuts this guy drives everywhere let alone the fact he probably hasn't even ridden a bike through the leg-bashing bollards.
I bet he wouldn't be able to navigate them and he would have to dismount.
Can't wait for bike-speed-bumps on the martingoodman though, I think that will probably be what they do next to "slow bike traffic".... more like slow bike use.
Honestly though the martin goodman I only use when I need to get to somewhere in the lakeshore vicinity so rarely do I use it. I prefer the downtown core queen/king to get around the city.
The "P" gates installed create such a tight pinch point that the grass to the outside of the gates are being worn as cyclists (and peds) go _around) the gates.
Peds use the bike crossing, bikes are using the zebra crossing intended for peds.
It's a mess.
I'm less and less impressed each time I have to use it.
If this is the "new standard", then I guess this a step backwards.
The "P" gates are ridiculous. All they do is make it more congested at the intersections and give you more stuff to worry about while crossing.
Riding along this new section of the trail adjacent and parallel to the road makes it like riding on a sidewalk, and it's impossible for a driver to anticipate and predict the approach and motion of a bicycle on a sidewalk at an intersection, be it a stop sign or a light.
I don't know what was wrong with the old route- it worked for me for many years.
I don't like this new section and I will avoid it if I can. Going eastbound I will use the road. Westbound is more difficult- I'll use as much of the old route as long as I can.
Sad- I feel like I'm being forced back onto the road!
Of course there is absolutely no benefit to the rework of the bike trail through Ontario Place, other than to obstruct automobile traffic and to use cyclists as speed bumps for automobiles. Prior to these changes there were no dangerous auto/cycling intersection points, everything flowed smoothly, and in my 18 years of commuting to work along the path, I have never seen a automobile and cyclist collision in Ontario Place. Of course the Boulevard Club is another story, especially with the introduction of the double bollards (thankfully they have been pared down to single bollards again). The Ontario Place bike path is now a death trap, and it's just a matter of time before someone is killed.
The City of Toronto is moving all out to stop vehicular traffic from coming into the city, and there is no genuine effort to make cycling safer. Bike lanes are simply another form of vehicular traffic control, and do nothing to increase cycling safety, and present a greater danger since they increase tension between cyclists and drivers, just like traffic calming is a complete misnomer. Traffic on Lakeshore is being impaired at every opportunity. Three new traffic lights going westbound into the core, reduced speeds, and a rework of the traffic flow at Lakeshore and Yonge, putting pedestrians in danger, and frustrating drivers.
The city of Toronto is destroying the existing roadway infrastructure, and has no viable plans to provide adequate transit alternatives. Although the current seemingly uncontrolled condo building boom gives the impression of prosperity, in the end, the city will decline as both the provincial and municipal governments are bankrupt, and the monstrous civil service, and public sector is reduced, eliminating any job growth prospects for the city. The private sector has, for the most part, already fled the city and they won't be coming back. Condo dwellers will have no way to get to their jobs in the suburbs, and they will have to leave the core to be closer to those jobs. Toronto will have to become a retirement community to survive. Well, only a few more years for me, and I'll be joining the retirees, but I feel for our children, their prospects of living a prosperous life in this city are looking bleak.
**When I first read this (two days after the path had opended) I thought it was an over-reaction. Then, I almost got killed at one of the lights just two days ago.
I commute daily along the path and was going through the intersection on a green light. A van was exiting Ontario place, waiting to make a right turn into Eastbound traffic on Lakeshore. I was coming along the bike path, Eastbound, and watched ahead as another cyclist went by the stopped van. I continued behind through the green light, when, at the last second he steps on the gas. I had absolutely time to do nothing, except scream "HEEYYYYY!!!!!" He hit the breaks just as I flew by his front end. I didn't get hit, but if I had, it would have been a bloody mess.
The first thing I would recommend for immediate action, before someone does get killed, is that the stop line for the cars coming out of Ontario place is set well back from Lakeshore, and, more importantly, there should be NO RIGHT TURNS ALLOWED EXITING ONTARIO PLACE ON A RED LIGHT. The way the car, bike, and pedestrian traffic come at all different speeds and angles at those intersections make it way too dangerous when cars are allowed to exit on a red light.
**
The design is unsafe, the city is going to be looking at an expensive lawsuit if they don't get on this quick because they've created a trap through approving this negligence.
I've been warned about it by a few cyclists - aside from those in this forum, so it's not just us!
I bet Ontario Place had it's hands up a councilors butt. For sure they want to make it easier for people to drive there and this includes letting them turn right on red. So, I'm suspecting Ontario Place as the main factor behind the city not making concessions for cyclists safety.
There was a fairly serious automobile accident at the Ontario Pl Blvd entrance ( eastern set of lights) this morning. Appeared to involve only automobiles, but one vehicle did wind up in the zebra crossing spilling parts and debris into the cycling lanes. There were personal injuries, and if anyone (cyclist, jogger, pedestrian, etc) happened to be in the area they could have easily been injured or killed.
Again, the sheer stupidity of the rework of this trail is unbelievable, but par for the course for the City of Toronto, led by Mayor Miller and his cohorts.
I could be wrong, but I doubt that the mayor had much to do with the redesign of this.
Casual criticisms of the Mayor (like the one above) make my eyes roll.
Every resident of this city has a Councillor that they can use to convey their interests and concerns to City Council, on top of that there are a number of Committees that meet regularly to hear concerns of the people of Toronto, or you can write a letter and direct it to the City Clerk and it will be copied to all Councillors upon your request.
To blame the Mayor for everything that you dislike about Toronto is about as unsubstantiated as you can get, yet so many people do it that I wouldn't want to spend 5 minutes in his shoes.
I disagree with the comment that Ontario Place did a poor job with the bike path. It has met every one of their objectives.
- Before there was only one entrance into the parking lot. Now there are three. Instead of their road being clogged it is the Lakeshore. The success was seen this morning.
- Absolute success. The old trail is closed. They don't have to worry about cyclists meeting their pedestrians. Cyclists aren't real customers anyways (read David Crombie statement in NOW a few years ago).
- $10 million from Waterfront Toronto. City maintains it.
- The gates at each intersection do that.
- There are traffic lights and traffic laws in Ontario. If their customers don't follow them, that is not their fault. All vehicle traffic should follow the law.
-Success. Instead of having the trail go straight and meet up at Strachan Ave. spend extra money and put in a big curve that means all users of the trail will see it. It's not their money anyways.
- They put in a bike trail didn't they. What more does the cycling community want?
Whether it was well designed or safe for users was irrelevant. They met their objectives. Therefore it is a success in their eyes.
own the road
i've never had any issues there ever
Guess you've never had a car try to own the same spot of road you're "owning".
Just because you're a pussy doesn't mean I'm a troll.
You pick your fights on the road. Ever been slapped on the ass by a passing motorist because they thought you took up too much space?
I'm choosy about where to "own the road". I bet others are too. You've clearly been lucky. Doesn't mean your advice is the be-all, end-all.
Particularly when you start calling people "pussies". Will "gay" be next?
http://sockpuppet.ca/xray
I'd taken the lane. A coward hit me from behind anyway. Then lied about circumstances.
The WWLRT does not make alot of sense unless it runs on the south side of Lakeshore west from Strachan. REAL transit access to Ontario Place and the western beaches is very much in need. This would also serve as an alternative to such motorholic destinations as the Boulevard Club, the Argonaut Rowing Club, various yacht clubs not to mention the Palais Royale and Sunnyside Bathing Pavillion. Reducing motor vehicle dependance here is imperative.
With consideration of extending the Jane LRT south (via the South Kingsway?) the Humber loop could potentially become a major terminus doing a great deal to connect Etobicoke with Toronto via TTC. IF the Jane, WWLRT, 501 and 507 (?) all connected here with the WWLRT and 507 continuing to Browns Line, the WWLRT would act as a quasi express through the western beaches/Ontario Place. Etobicokans would have an attractive alternative to the subway into the core.
Ok. I'll say it. The trail should not cross driveways.
The previous trail bounding the lake and wending under width under the eastern pedestrian bridge at least attempted to do that. It very much seemed an afterthought to road access planning. Assertive bicyclists avoided the diversion and took the access road east of the west access connector. NOTE: this route is still preferable to what has been put in its place. Lakeshore traffic was less likely to cut blindly across the trail.
My understanding is what was provided to the former cycling committee was essentially a list of alternatives, the present implementation being the least evil of the bunch. This is in agreement with what both you and Hamish are stating. Also the cycling committee was not given opportunity to study or propose alternatives.
MGT SHOULD NOT CROSS DRIVEWAYS. MGT should be considered as much a thoroughfare as Lakeshore and expecting bicyclists to yield right of way to motorholics using driveways crossing it is ridiculous.
Given that, managing crossing motor vehicles more effectively should cut the casualty rate. That said the trails present alignment threatens to introduce bicyclists to the joy of connecting their heads to lamp standards. The contortions in navigating the p gates set bicyclists up to use the pedestrian sides in places. Confusion on which side to pass the poles on will inevitably result in slamming into them.
Ontario Place staff were blowing their stop sign remarkably consistently at the east entry before the realignment of MGT. I've also been forced off the road by Ontario Place security while riding at over 30 kph on the access road. A car that pulls up beside you and moves over before clearing is hostile IMHO. Complaining accomplished nothing. No followup, no acknowledgement despite providing a licence number and specific details including time and circumstance. The vehicle parked in the west access and those exiting indeed wore uniforms.
Does Ontario Place count Daimler Chrysler aka FIAT as a major sponsor? Does this sway its operations?
you give them too much political credit. they simply (clearly) don't give a shit about cyclists down there. We're just NOT a priority. Out of towners, and local motorists are.